RELATED POST: Sep 2013 Council Tax Reduction – The phrase heard round the world
Having not paid Council tax since last August 2009 some very interesting facts have emerged. This information has been backed up by others who have uncovered the same routine, in which Councils act completely unlawfully.
After you decide not to pay Council, tax you will receive a ‘Summons’ to the local magistrates Court.
This appears to be a Summons issued by the Court. It bears a royal seal and is “signed” by the Clerk to the Justices for the petty sessional area of xxxx. It states:
“Complaint has this day been made before the undersigned by the London Borough of xxxx. You being a person liable to pay the Council tax and from whom payment of that tax has been duly demanded have not paid the sum as due below.”
“You are therefore Summonsed to appear before the magistrates at xxxx on xxxx at xxxx
“If you do not appear, you may be proceeded against as if you had appeared and dealt with according to the law”.
The first paragraph states that,
“complaint has been made before the undersigned.”
This looked immediately suspicious as the “signature” for Clerk to the Justices seemed to be deliberately deceptive as it was indecipherable, and photocopied onto the document (Part of the signature on this particular Summons was cut off) The other big problem being there was no name printed under the ‘signature.’
Having phoned both the Court and the Council and neither being able to tell me who signed the Summons I put in a freedom of information request to the Councils head of Governance and Law as to who was the acting Clerk to the Justices in the borough. The reply I got indicated that this person definitely did not sign the document. The Council were then instructed that the document was defective as it was not signed by a person known to the Court or the Council.
In the first Notice served on the Councils Head of Revenues and Benefits it was suggested that the Summons was defective. The Head of Revenues and Benefits replied:
“Summonses must be authorised by a Justice of The Peace or Clerk to the Justices and who’s signature appears on the Summons must have personally considered the complaint. As you now know this makes the Summons lawful and not defective as stated in your letter paragraph 5b.”
This is typical of the response from Councils, there is an over confident reply which is completely at odds with the facts. They also refer to Notices as ‘letters.’ There seems to be a cosy arrogance in all the correspondence, and if you nail them on anything they say its their ball and they are not playing! They are compartmentalised within their departments and seem to have no idea or no interest in what is really going on, those higher up the corporate ladder however must know.
Maybe some of my info did sink in as I Noticed that the job of Head of benefits and Revenues was recently being advertised in a local employment agency window!
Yes WE Summons you to Court
The next revelation was even better! It became clear that the Summons document was the same typeface and border as other Council documents. Yes, the Council issue their own Summonses! Now this has been confirmed as fact by Council staff. This is fraud and perjury under the 1911 Perjury Act and a crime under the Administration of Justice Act. Anyone except a Court issuing a document, that appears to be from a Court, is breaking the law.
This was pointed out in the next Notice to the Head of Benefits and Revenues but the reply came from someone else in the department. This seems to be the strategy when difficult questions arise – nobody takes responsibility. The reply stated,
“No further correspondence on the issues you have raised will be entered into.”
As far as the suggestion goes that the Council was guilty of fraud and perjury, their response was that they would defend themselves in Court and I would be liable for their costs if they won the case. This makes sense, as in the Borough I live the Court and town hall are on the same Council owned land. If your part of the corporation, everybody Wins!
It now appears that Councils all over the Country issue their own Summonses, they then hire a room in the Court for a ‘bulk hearing.’ The room is not part of the Court, as the Court are not involved (apart from financially). This has also been confirmed by people who work in the Court. As there is no due process being followed here, it would appear the whole procedure is a sham.
Issuing a Summons
If there is a case to be heard in the Court it has to be sent to the Court clerk (or Court manager at County Court) to consider, they then issue a Summons which is sent directly from the Court. As the Council issue the Summons it is not a Court matter, they just make it appear so by inviting (Summonsing) the person to the Court. As this is just a procedural matter for summary judgement (person already liable) and not of course a “hearing” it makes sense for them to do it themselves!
No Liability Order
The Council then state in the follow up documentation, ‘Notice of impending enforcement action’ or ‘Liability Order notification’ – this means a Liability Order was issued against the person, but it’s of course not possible as there was no Court. No Liability Order has been received from the Court by anybody I have met who has stopped paying Council tax. The reason for this is of course because there was no Court. Two corporations are involved, the Council who hire the room in the Court; and Court officials/staff in the Court who are paid by the Council. In many boroughs the Town Hall, Council buildings and Court are on the same land, owned by the Council.
This ‘Notice of impending enforcement action’ or ‘Liability Order notification’ is not a Liability Order. It also makes threats including making you bankrupt in the high Court with all assets frozen; being sent to prison; a charging Order put on your property; and then at the end of this diatribe, appointment of bailiffs. These documents are pretty generic in the different boroughs and presumably represent new powers given to local authorities – they are deliberately intimidating, but enforcing all this is of course a completely different matter.
A Liability Order has to be signed by the Judge or Magistrate and also sealed by Court. It is then sent to the person liable and also the Claimant. If the amount on the Order is not paid within the specified time then the Court can appoint bailiffs on behalf of the Claimant.
Debt collectors not Bailiffs
The Council although unable to produce a real Liability Order, then states that bailiffs have been appointed on behalf of the Council to recover the debt. This is of course impossible as there was no Court, so no bailiffs can be appointed, as they must have an Order from the Court that appointed them.
Bailiffs also have to be reregistered every two years; have an ID number; and give their full name, which can be verified by doing an Internet search. Debt collectors call themselves bailiffs and rely on peoples’ ignorance. Your birth certificate made you a ‘person’ who is ‘liable’ so ‘let he who will be deceived be deceived.’
The corporate nature of the Councils and Courts just means they pretend that bailiffs have been instructed, this is of course not possible so they appoint a debt collection agency who then send out ‘bailiff’ letters. These letters are very threatening in capital letters with a box stating ‘Removal of your goods’ or ‘Bailiff Removal.’
Bailiffs do have certain powers to collect debts, but debt collectors do not! (The powers given to bailiffs can be easily found on the Internet). Debt collectors do claim they are bailiffs and also send out documentation that is unlawful and completely unethical.
The problem with all these ‘bailiff’ letters that I have seen is that none of them bear the Bailiffs full name, certification number and Court Order reference, which of course they must have if they are issued by a bailiff.
This means of course that the debt collection agency is a third party interloper who has purchased or contracted with the Council for the Council tax debt offences. This means that the debt no longer has anything to do with the Council and the debt collector has no real power of enforcement action as a Court was not involved.
Ask your Council for a true copy of a Liability Order and see what happens, things could go VERY quiet.
Return to sender
If you want to have some fun look up the debt collection company on the companies house register and redirect all mail back to the Managing Director (after having served Notice on him or her with fee schedule attached) at their registered address and update your fee schedule on each new envelope that you return.
If you want to read what these computer printout ‘Notices’ say hold them up to a powerful light and you will see it all through the envelope. One thing is for sure, it won’t be signed by a bailiff with the relevant info. Another good idea is to let them know that your fees for handling their deceptive ‘bailiff’ letters will be collected by a debt collection agency! This has to be the next logical step, getting debt collectors onto the debt collectors and Councils.
The Councils only form of redress after this is to go to Court and put a Charging Order on your property if you ‘own’ it or try some other route like trying to get you into Court. If you ignore all this there seems to be little they can do, as they run out of ideas when the robotic paper trail stops. If you are on Benefits or in Council property refusing to pay Council tax, it may not be a good idea, as they can evict you or have Benefits stopped at source.
And finally for your delectation and delight… The unlawful Debtors Notice… Flatulence in contract is an offence.
Along with the document ‘Notice of impending enforcement action’ or ‘Liability Order notification’ the Council also include a ‘Notice’ to debtors, which makes threats and menaces. It also makes unlawful ‘demands’ for information on the reverse. There is also a quote from a local Councilor! The document states:
“It is an offence not to complete and return the enclosed financial information form”. xxxx xxxx Council are now taking legal action against customers who do not return their form fully completed. This legal action will result in a criminal conviction and fine of up to £1000.”
This is of course completely untrue. Other Boroughs just ‘request’ this information, my Council demand it as if it is the law. This ‘demand’ is of course never followed up. Information demanded includes National Ins number; name of employer; address of employer; date of birth; and all details of benefit claims etc. Then there’s part C that states you MUST fill it in. This demands name; email address; telephone number; and then of course you MUST sign it!
These threats are carried on at the bottom of the form saying,
“You will be committing a criminal offence if you do not give the above information and you can be fined up to £1000 pounds, as well as getting a criminal record. The same will happen if you give information that is not true.”
They also state that they would take legal action against anyone who did not fill the form in and that cases had been held in magistrates Court and the debtors receiving fines of £100 plus £85 costs. This is a bare faced lie!
Of course if you were unfortunate or gullible enough to fill in this badly worded junk mail they really have got you. If you filled it in and gave false information that would indeed be an offence. Fraudulence in contract IS an offence, but IGNORING an unlawful piece of paper is not!
One of the other many problems with the form is that the Council is known ONLY as LBWF and it was confirmed in writing that xxxx xxxx Council did not exist! Their corporate office stated this in a freedom of information request. I also included this in my Notice that demanding payment for an organisation which did not exist appeared to be fraudulent. This fact was of course ignored.
Having found out the name of the Council solicitor who put this rubbish together, I stated this would be investigated. Having served Notice on the Head of Governance and Law, (the top lawyer in the Borough), I can say from experience these people do not know how to do their jobs or even know the law, and they just seem to break it when it suits them.
In short there is a lot of noise and threats made which are just hot air in order to scare the public into paying off the banks and the national debt!
For anyone who saw the film “Councils, Courts and Conmen” on YouTube the Order at the end of the film was not a Liability Order, just the amount of liable persons who were ‘Summoned’ to the Court. There was no name on the Order, it was simpler just to make the point that the ‘liability’ was established before the hearing, and of course they had to book Court number 1 because 14 witnesses turned up! This appears to be just part of the huge corporate scam that Councils are involved in. There is much more we have uncovered and will post in due course.
Well that’s the end of the paper trail for now. However, when there is a registered PERSON at your address, you know there is bound to be more!
YouTube: landofthefreeuk
Councils , Courts and Conmen
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northampton council bulk centre still sending out warrents for none payment of council tax which they pretend are from the magistrate court which is fraud but the police and courts and judges are not doing anything about it the whole system is corrupt but they dont care cos its all about keeping us in tow
I have not the read the comments above:
I did not pay my council tax last year – Leicester Council sent me summons to appear at Leicester magistrates (LM) court. I spoke with LM – they told me – it has NOTHING to do with us you must deal with the council. I said to to them so the council hire a private room in the Magistrates court and have their own private judges and it has nothing to do with you – they said, YES! The Magistrates summons are are fakes printed off a printer by the bastard criminal council – committing the crime of fraud – 10 yrs jail min. You must NOT turn up for court. This is the key – council, courts, prime/ministers, political parties (labour, Conservative etc), your and mine name in CAPITALS are ALL CORPORATIONS – the courts are not ‘common law’ courts which deal with ‘living souls’ they are corporation courts – dealing with LEGAL/contract law only – that does not apply to ‘living souls’. Hence, a COURT (corporation) CANNOT SEE A LIVING SOUL – until that living soul states ‘yes’ when asked if they are the corporation – your ALL CAPS NAME – which is you the machine. A machine (corporation/account) can only interact with another a machine – it cannot see or smell or taste and thus DOES NOT EXIST – it exists by proxy when you give it energy by falling into the deception of becoming the machine by admitting you are your ALL CAPS – machine name – you become NON-EXISTANT and the machine takes your energy and becomes you – to destroy you.
Seal you front door – the system is designed to get EVERYONE who is not one of the elite into debt – 99% of ALL front doors open INWARDS – why so the baillifs can easily kick them in – put 3/4 logs behind you front door (I am doing mine and making a youtube video to show people how it is done), put a 4 camera security system around your house – secure you back door and use your back door.
When the baillifs come – and if they call the police – go out the back and round to the front – demand they move of you property and then demand – ‘PROOF OF CONTRACT’ that they or the council have a legal contract with you – that you signed (never admit you name – they are using your machine name for the debt) – of course none exists – they in essence are claiming before a judge/court that there is contract between you and them and that you breached the contract and that they suffered loss and now are claiming damages against you (council tax).
If somehow you end up in court and the judge demands you pay so and so – state that you will pay if the court within 7 days can prove that all the money in circulation is backed up by anything of value (95% of the money is backed up by nothing! thus money is worth – this it does not exist – we make it exist – by our energy – take your energy back and demand proof – you cannot pay with that does not exist).
I bless you all for the work you done on this site, it has helped me to research these things out and test them and I hope my feedback is valuable. Please note the war is all about moving the worlds peoples of ALL NATIONS into an ‘all surrender situation’ and then ‘CAUSING’ THEM TO TAKE THE MARK OF THE BEAST – 666 or die. Once the MARK is take IN (not on) THE RIGHT-HAND or IN (not on) THE FOREHEAD – it game over – your destiny is sealed in hell forever. and the final end of the world war will then begin. Only Jesus Christ the Lord God is our hope.
[KJV] Rev 13:16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
[KJV] Rev 13:17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
[KJV] Rev 13:18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.
I am willing to pay the person in court ”layman” to represent ME in court as well for a Specific fee…… Is this possible. Please let me know 😀
cant go into to much detail at this time, as more legal action pending.
went to court this week against a bailiff and won. but have learnt some interesting stuff.
you must name the bailiff company in proceedings as well as the indivdual bailiff,if not and the bailiff has cancelled or did not have a bond in place you will not get any compensation. i also got all his fee’s listed on his levy cancelled. of interest was the van fee the judge agreed that a van fee was not a valid fee by the bailiff as the bailiff could not produce any evidence as to how the fee was shown to be reasonable (shedule 5 of council tax table of fee’s) also got a judgement statin that as his levy was not signed, no fee’s were in fact collectable by the bailiff, the bailiff left the property of his own free will without a signature on his levy therefore he abandoned the goods, as the bailiff company still collected the fee’s this was deemed unlawfull and classed as recieving money from the proceeds of a crime …. the bad news was that he could take no action on these points as i had not named the bailiff company as respondants……once all proceedings are completed i will make availiable all the important stuff for you all in order that it may assist others………good luck to you all ….my fight goes on….and i fully intend to win the next round of hearings…in any event ill certainly give them a hard time…..
Hello everyone. All well and good all this information regarding rebutting council tax and the ongoing fraud that lies within.You cannot win. Ever. No matter how many letters you send, points you raise or lawful facts you point out. I have traveled the full journey of withholding payment, non payment, whatever you want to call it. Not just because maybe im a rebel, or just think why should I pay, let someone else. I really feel the criminal injustice of the made up on the spot laws that are designed to keep us down in serfdom and enrich the already rich. It makes me sick, deep within. I have folders full of letters, recorded delivery receipts etc.Even have an audio recording of the conversation I had with the ‘courts’ where they clearly admitted the summons was nothing to do with them, the council print and issue those, fact. That call was made immediately after my request to the council about just who exactly had signed the summons. Seeing off the bailiffs was easy, and great fun! no court order, no liability order, implied right of access revoked etc. case was returned back to the council as the bailiffs were powerless, apart from being quite able in issuing threats, fear and stress.Having eventually found work after 3 years unemployment (was in hospital for a long time after a very nasty accident), the wages are crap (does anyone remember back when TPB asked for everyone to job share, take less salary, less hours etc. ‘to help avert austerity’?) we are all working, well those fortunate enough to be in work, for 1985 equivalent wages, don’t get me wrong, I have a skilled job with a still successful, profit making company. Endgame for the council was issuing one final letter, committal proceedings. Boom! Do I still stand my ground, fight the good fight? And go to prison? Lose my job? Back onto benefit system? I know the court will be a private affair, ask Roger Hayes, bless him, and that will be that. Yep, caved in and agreed £150 month repayments plus £40 bailiffs fees, for which I still have not received an official receipt, despite several requests, only a letter from said council saying yes, we took £40 for bailiff fees. Makes me bitter and angry as hell, still, every damn day. But what can you do? Really? Nothing, Nada, Zilch. The system is made and run this way, always will. Really sad to say, but until we get an MP or someone else with balls who can access the upper ranks to represent us against the unlawful tyrannical dictators that ‘rule’ this country, we are fucked, with a capital F. Many thanks to all the fab folk who have shared their knowledge on there forums so that we might make a stand for ourselves but it pains me to say, better luck to someone else. Im tired of the fight for now. It has had its fun moments but when threatened with prison, nah, it aint for me. Sorry.
Namaste
Pete – an admirable post. You sound like someone who has trodden the path to more or less the same point that I did. And so, you back down. And all the time, the only power they actually used was creating fear in your mind through words on paper, purporting to a version of reality which you must believe in.
The emails come in every day, from people asking for help with mortgages and council tax. When are people going to understand. The only thing that will *ever* *truly* *work* is mass refusal to cooperate, or to even pay attention.
Saying no can be a positive thing, but it has to be said together, by the many. So go ahead and find and meet people locally to you and be amazed by the strength you have when you act together – http://lawfulrebellion.crowdmap.com
And don’t ever give up, don’t ever let your head bow.
hi everyone,i asked tammworth council “i realise council tax is legal, but is it lawful?” they promptly wrote back saying “council tax is regulated by the local government finance act,statute law which takes precedence over common law”….is that correct? looking forward to your answer..thank you in advance!
Hey there, I suppose the argument goes back to ‘does common law exist’, because a statute is only enforceable with consent – when consent exists then you have contract and therefore contract law/UCC/Admiralty applies. But essentially it comes down to what paradigm you are defending. Obviously councils are going to enforce statute as they are governed entirely by them – they are corporations – but you are not. You choose what you consent to. Common law is common sense, statute is fascist franchise colonialism.
Hi
My other half and I have been summonsed to Leicester magistrates Court for non .- payment. We have been emailing the council and they have been replying, but with a noteable arrogance. We were receiving full council tax benefit under self employment as my other half was made redundant and I am self employed, however I am disabled and my work suffers. So much so that I usually only break even or at times lose money. I continue because its better than giving in to the disabilty and doing nothing and better than signing onto soul destroying job centre plus for unemployment. My disability was due to military service.
I was asked to fill in self employment details and in return I was sent a Bill informing me that we had been awarded full CT benefit. However, we recently recieved a Summons for non payment. On emailing the Council I have been told that a few weeks after my full CTB Bill they had sent me another Bill which informed me that we had to pay around 65 – 70 percent of the Bill. I have not seen this Bill nor any other follow up demands they now say they sent.
I had been hoping that they would see sense and reinstate the Bill we did get, but they simply say that we need to pay the ‘outstanding’ amount. they cannot even tell me why we seem to have been awarded a partial discount as only 65-70 percent is being demanded.
We go to court in a few weeks and my health isnt great so I am concerned about being able to go to defend myself. Any advice?
We have also received the new financial years Bill with a note on the back regarding the new Council tax support (replacing Benefit). Of course nothing has been applied to the first bill issus so it is for full amount. the notes advise that anyone who thinks they should get support should call the council on a 0845 number – why not a geographical numbr that is inculded in call packages? – and that you should make payments as stated until they issue you with a new Bill if they think you deserve help. what about those with hardly a bean to feed their kids?!? Ive known some councils to take over 6 months to sort this kind of admin out, so people with no money are being told to prioritise CT over feeding themselves … its a disgrace!
(advice for above gratefully received)
Thanks
I find it heartening to see that so many are waking up to the fact we are being manipulated constantly by Governments, banks and those we cannot see who are imposing there arrogance upon the many making our lives impossible to live. This has to end and the more people like you helping those less knowledgeable is admirable. I too have had enough of their constant manipulation. It will only get worse unless they are exposed. I wish i had the intelligence to do what all of you are doing. If i may, i would like to say thank you on behalf of all us who are constantly hounded.
I have refused to pay council tax for a year as I dont agree with it. 1) Why should I pay nearly the same amount as a family of 6? afterall i will use far less resources and services than them. My point is that the tax should based on a fee per person in the household not the size of the house. Afterall it’s the person that uses roads, libraries etc and not the house! A mansion containing two people will pay far more than a family of 10 on benefits living in 3 rooms. that is not fair. 2) I hardly use many council services (in fact i would prefer pay per use system which is fairer to working child free people like me)
I have received all the threatening letters which i have ignored. the debt collector has knocked twice on my door and i refused him entry. if you ignore their letters and do not let the facists in then there’s nothing they can do.
i find it hilarious they are going to spend all this time and money in chasing me when they could be chasing a crooked landlord who has say 40 undeclared houses. I am fighting the law and I am winning.
im now having to pay 1350 a week council tax and i get D.L.A aswell as bedroom tax i live with my 8yr and 10 yr kids im going to refuse to pay the council tax but will have to pay the bedroom tax there is no way im paying it when i can just afford to look after myself and kids could anyone give me advice pls and thanks for everybodys advice on here
Hi, this is a very interesting post…I have my own situation which I need advice on. Ive been working overseas for about a year and my brother who is a student has been living in my house. When i conacted my council to ask about council tax they said that they couldn’t find my flat o the system and hat once i recive a letter I should be i touch…yeah right!!
So its a year or so later and still no communication…
My question is this do they sometimes get delayed or is it likely that they just dont know about my flat? (it’s a housing association flat)
Also Im paying the rent and he’s giving me cash…if it’s a student staying there do i still have to pay tax
Finally should i apply for a visitor parkimg permit or coupd this rais flags with the council as to where this flat has com from
Thanks
Brian
In order to make the big impact…we have to resist these unlawful taxes in the thousands. They would not be able to cope with the numbers if court cases. If I were to stop paying this disgusting garnish of my hard earned money….i would lose my goods (the little I have) as these evil swines would send in the thug bailiffs. We really are up against thuggery…from these mafia agencies. My son had his car taken away and crushed because his tax had expired and although it was off road and not being used….these devils still took it away.
Can anyone give me advise on how to do this in Scotland. Is it the same procedure / laws as is in England ?
In short you’d be well (non-legally) advised to *avoid controversy* – meditate on that.
When a debt is sold to a Debt Collection Agency (via a deed of assignment), does the Debt Collector becomes the Creditor for the purposes of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 and are the rights and duties assigned? Please state court case, legislation in your answer.
I have been on both sides of the fence worker and unemployed I have lived through three recessions and times haven’t changed for the poor or working class the backbone of this country , so before council support there was council tax and before that poll tax ( and at the time it felt like a victory but we know now it was not ! ) then there were rates the fair tax for the poor and working class , it ment the rich pay more as they should and know if they live in a mansion they pay three times more than anyone who lives in a bedsit ! Anyone who thinks that’s right you need to see a Dr ! There no logic to this country they give child benefit to people who don’t need it heating allowances to them who don’t need it free bus pass these were for the poor the working class and anyone who earns over 52000 pa don’t need the governments help but the system is being abuses and don’t get me started on the bankers who run the country ! Not a penny back from them and the country is in debt so they say !
hey can you give me some advice please, i live with my partner and we have lived in this flat for 5 years almost without paying council tax ( my partner refuses to do so) anyway in feb we had yet another council caller and they caught me in a bad moment so i answered my intercom, wouldnt open door for them just talked on intercom but she asked my name and i told her my maiden name which isnt the name i use. now someone has been to the door this afternoon and knocked and because i didnt answer have left a letter with what seems to be court action ( cant see through envelope) and it is in my name Have to say im worried now because i only work part time and cant afford to pay out of my wages and they say they can take directly from my wages. My partner says im being silly when i worry about it but cant help it, is it true that this is all a hoax and is the council threatening not the court. Because have to say they arent giving up and my health is not getting any better with all the worry.
thanks tilly x
Hi,
I was just wondering what happens when the council demands money for council tax from a deceased person? I am in that position as my mother passed away at the end of last year and they have now issued a summons in the name of ‘Exors of…’ Is this legal? They have issued the usual ‘summons’. How does one respond to this? I have already written to them stating she left no estate and they have written back requesting details of her solicitor.
Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks.
can anybody answer a couple of questions( i dont mean to be rude but need facts not guesses)
1)Schedule 12 tribunals courts and enforcement act 2007 section 54 = if controlled goods are abandoned then, in relation to the enforcement power concered, the following applies-(a)the enforcement power ceases to be exerciseable.
does this only mean that the bailiffs cannot return or does the liability order also cease to be in effect?
2) if it is a joint liability order can an attachment of earnings order be put in place against only one of the persons? the council tax regulations seem to imply that attachment of earnings orders can only be used where it is an individual order-meaning one person.
3)as a liability order is made out in the name of the council can a council collect bailiff fee’s with an attachment of earnings order? as the bailiff service is no longer inhouse but contracted out -thereby the bailiff company becomes a third party
thankyou in advance to anybody who can provide answers….
Looks like I’m going to be criminalised for being poor then!
Just who the hell do we ow all this debt? And why can’t we tell them to sing for it
i have an issue: at the bottom of my birth certificate it states “WARNING: A CERTIFICATE IS NOT EVIDENCE OF IDENTITY”
please help, as i feel that in the case of Mr. X being presented for and on the record, cannot be accepted as an identity
it seems as though this thread has been inundated with questions. a quick one then, has anybody got any links so i may further my research and resolve?
can any1 giv advice I haven’t paid poll tax and council ever in my life will the shit hit the fan for me ?
Urgent. My son just received a letter from Rossendale’s about an address he has no recollection of in a different area some 10yrs ago stating Council Tax debt owed on Rossendale’s own paper. My question is can they pursue this CT after all this time as I thought Statutory time limit was contact after 6yrs is void on debts, but is it same for CT?
Thank you.
Well you can contact your local MP formally.
Due to incorrect information given to me by Haringey council, I ended up receiving a summons. Haringey refused to accept responsibility for their actions so I went and sought advice from 2 different agencies both told me to accept liability order and have the money taken out of my benefit. Thankfully, we have forums like these, the information was shocking, made my blood boil but gave me hope at the same time. Anyway, I turned up at court , and saw council employees sitting in the waiting room calling out numbers that had been issued. When mine was called, I asked when I would be able to see the magistrate, the woman was taken aback and said she would talk to her senior, 3 minutes later she came back and said they would wipe off the £125.00 court costs which was all I wanted in the first place. Around 60 people must have gone into ‘court’ that day all paying the additional £125.00. They are conning the poorest people in society and it sickens me. I am informing everyone I know of this scam with the hope that it becomes common knowledge.
Go get em sue x
This is such a good video. I have found it while looking for evidence of corruption commited by my local council. Well, it isn’t corruption per se, it more not telling the whole story and running the local council tax scheme like Paul Daniels (now you see, now you don’t). My local council issued (on its own initiative) letters stating that everybodies council tax discount (single person occupancy) would be cancelled unless they got in touch with the council to stop the cancellation. They sent out those letters disguised as junk mail. No surprisingly, the majority threw the letters away and therefore were non the wiser about what the council intended to do. A year later, the council sent out default notices claiming that people who had paid their council tax, were suddenly in arrears because they had paid their council tax at a discounted rate, when in actual fact the council had been expecting a higher amount, because the council had cancelled peoples discounts.
Eleven years later, and the council are still chasing me for the extra amount that they simply made up. Prior to all of this, I was obedient to them but now I hate and despise them with a passion. You see, I do not tolerate corruption and this my freinds, is corruption plain and simple. But in the councils eyes, its just, well, its just an excuse to repeat over and over again, the law they abide by, and an excuse to blame me for not abiding by…therefore in the councils eyes, I am a criminal.
But I am in a situation now where no money can be recovered, they are now chasing their own tails and simply recycling the old debt as a means to artificially inflate their corporate assets.
And that puts me in control.
FOLLOW UP COUNCIL TAX
Talk about incompetence, despite the fact the details of the agreement to pay my council tax bill alone have been noted on their system, they have still sent a liability order for the full amount. I do have it in black and white but as I do not trust them one iota, I am curious to know, if when I went to ‘court’ I did not go through the proper process, is the liability order legal. Bearing in mind it says On xx/xx/xxxx in the Haringey magistrates court at (address) a liability order in the sum of £265.56 was granted with additional costs of £125.00. Payment is due immediately fill in the attached details of earnings etc. Who was the liability order granted by, and at what point during my short visit did this happen. Would appreciate any advice. Thank you
many many thanks, an extremely informative piece on the
local authorities fraudulent actions against ctx payers and
those who rightfully refuse to pay this illegal tax- yes its an
illegal tax, especiall if you have “Not voted to pay it in any,
way shape or form. from Mr Ablett Lester
Advice required !
I got into arrears with my council tax as our council has a cutoff date of the 14th of the month and after that point you are deemed to be in arrears then you go through the process of losing the right to pay in installments. Any way my accounts have been put in the hands of a company called Rossendales (taken over by Marstons) I have complained to Rossendales about the behaviour of the Bailiffs and this has not been taken seriously. I have asked the council to take my debt back which I believe it is my right to do and they have refused to do this . Where do I go from here ???
Hi there, this is great I’m really glad there’s people out there that realise the government and their cronies are unlawfully ripping us off every day to the point where you have nothing left. Ten years ago I was told that 5% of the worlds population owned 95% of the worlds wealth, these days with the government only interested in helping big business and fucking us normal people over I would say it’s probably 2% owning 98% and that 2% is the government!
I only Wish i had read this article earlier , I have been a recent victim of the councils crimes and wonder if anyone could tell me if there’s anything i can do about it ?
My girlfriend neglected to pay the council tax, after the summons etc they started taking money out of my pay before i even got it !! They wrote to my employer who then took deductions off my pay before it went into my bank surely this is illegal in some way ?? Id really appreciate someone who knows about this kind of thing writing back i hate these bastards so much I’d love a chance to get one back !
Council tax is taken from my very small salary ( I am working in coffee shop – )is there any way I could stop it?
I owe the courts some £6500. Im sick the death of these thieves making me pay simply to be alive. If it comes to it I will do prison, but hope that failing to recognise the courts will suffice. As yet the council has failed to get me to court after 3 years…The bailiffs have failed to collect the purported debt and the last correspondence I have from the council is a threat to apply to the courts for an arrest warrant. I have no idea if they can obtain an arrest warrant or if the police will arrest me. When and if they do, I intend to refuse to recognise the courts authority and ask the magistrates or any others representing the court to them to swear an oath upholding the law of the land. I have no idea where this will go after this but will refuse to recognise the court if they get me there……..-
– The question is can the councils apply for a warrant of arrest through the legal court system if I refuse to pay the debt?
@Matty – If you are struggling, you can only claim financial hardship, submit detailed financial statement, explain your situation and offer a decent arrangement based on your income & outgoings and see if they take you up on it, if they do though and then you default payment they’ll reattach or send to bailiffs.
@Joe – Its completely legal, you should have paid your bill. If you dont pay they are able to take your money straight from source, nothing you can do about that. You’ve suffered summons charges and admin costs from your payroll dept which you could have avoided otherwise.
@Maggiemay – no where, if your account has been passed to a bailiff you would have had multiple chances to pay before it got to that point and so if everything was done correctly, per your councils procedures, they would have no reason to bring it back.
@sue – yes its legal, you only have to attend court if you dispute liability, i.e. you werent the responsible person for the house. It usually says this on the summons. Council Staff are there to see who turns up and if any actually meet the criteria to go into the court room, disputes about paying late, benefit, discounts etc arent valid reasons to enter court. The magistrates grant it in the court room. Technically council tax (before summons) is due in full but Councils allow monthly instalments. The same applies once you’ve been summonsed, they allow you to pay by your means.
@terry – you’re an idiot. discount reviews are normal, they have a duty to check everyones paying what they should, if you have nothing to hide just answer the form.
@bernadette – that doesnt apply to Council Tax, they can collect however old it is.
@joe – at some point, probably yes.
@flightback – re 2) joint liability order = joint and several liability council tax account = both parties can be responsible to pay the whole debt, the council can go after both parties, for an attachment they would choose the one with the higher earnings or attachable earnings. re 3) i’m not completely clear on your question – cant have bailiffs and attachments running at the same time, if an attachment got to the point where your account was then in credit the council could pay any of your old bailiff fees on your behalf
@martin – you’ve done the right thing, just provide proof she has no estate and that’ll be end of it.
@tilly – you should pay your bills.
@brian – they either dont know about your flat (but they usually would with a hsg ass), you contacted the wrong council, or you’re not getting your post. Its still your main home so despite your circumstances it wouldnt change how you’re billed.
@billy – apply for a dhp (councils have limited budgets for these though so get in quick)
@ann tate – that sounds like poll tax, which most people didnt like.
@paul – 0845 call centres for revs & bens are usually charged at the local rate on a landline. the revised bill would have been based on further assessments of your income which meant you were not entitled to as much. and from 1.4.13 no one other than pensioners get full benefit. they ask you to pay as billed because sometimes it takes a while to sort out your benefits or other correspondence and so if the outcome isnt in your favour at least your as up to date as possible.
kenny – bailiff attended my house levy wa not signed and bailiff abandoned the goods meaning no futher enforcement action could be taken- the council were fully aware of this, but said the bailiffs fee’s still had to be paid. i contested this and informed them i was taking legal action against the bailiff for fraudulent fee’s. before the matter came to court the council used an attachment of earnings order to collect his fees. (the court ruled non the fee’s were claimable by the bailiff. what i need to now is were the council acting illegally? as the original liability order is granted to the council the bailiff is a third party. in addition the courts tribunals and enforcement act sched 12 says if bailiff abandons goods the enforcement power ceases to exist, but does not say if it means that the actual liability order ceases to be vailid or just the particular action i.e use of bailiff.
I ended up getting one of these summons for non payment of Council Tax even though I’d paid up in full until they day I moved out of my last address. Seems the local council couldn’t cope with a) processing my new address, even though I’d told them via post, online and phone b) the fact I no longer live with my ex flatmate, as the summons had just been sent to her new address and our old address. The outstanding ‘debt’ was from the period after we moved out. Now they’re trying to add court fees and garnish my wages for the £0 I owe them! What a waste of taxpayers money and resources, do they just aimlessly send these joke summons out to anyone and everyone these days?
hi there need some advise I move out my flat at the end of febuary 2013 and I did the tell the council I moved out and the landlords details by doing it online . my council tax was paided up todate but yesterday I had bayliffs round for unpaid tax which is for this year march to april 2014 I got to contact the council today to see whats going on . any advise ?
Hi it seems Councils all over the country flaunt the law, I would like to know if anyone knows of anyone that has actually made an official complaint to the police regarding the fraudulent activities or what I see as demanding money with menaces, or deception etc etc All of which are criminal offences. I am about to send a whole file to my local police regarding the illegal activities on my council, it will be interesting to see what happens maybe I’ll get harassed by them as well as the council.
I’ll actually be going down the police station tommorow to make a “Official complaint of a crime” as the Police have a legal duty to investigate, I will then after this report inform them of my intentions to go to the council offices to present a request for all communications from them to myself (* as they breached process without following there own guidelines by issueing a correct final demand *). Again the “Summons” has no legible signature and claims to represent a member of the courts (* the Clerk *), I will also be requesting under the FOI a list of all council employees who have had any relations to the case for further reporting to the police and instigating investigations into GrossMisconduct in office. U will update tomorrow to let you all know how I got on.
My husband and i receive a letter from the council telling us that we are liable to pay council tax, and we recently receive a letter from the bailif telling us that we should pay them to, and we are renting a private one bedroom flat, my husband pay council tax for both of us because I’ m not working and is close to 300 pound a moth he pay
Can any one please tell me if these letters that we receive can affect from applying for my british citizen if yes that mean I have to wait an other 3 years before I can apply
my council issued a summon against me wrongly as I do not owe them
when I went to the court they ask for adjournment and it was granted
can I claim cost of that wasted day?Any advise please
Hi there im pretty new to all of this and was looking for some help really, my partner has recieved a council tax liability order stating he has to pay a certain amount within 14days or bailiffs will come and recover the amount outstanding, it states here in the letter that the council was granted a liability order against him by the magistrates court. What should be my first steps to resolving this properly as we do not think we should pay any of it. please help…..
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